What's new for the MZR 2.3L DISI engine?

[spek1098]

I use to be one of those who followed every turn and every development for our beloved and belittled MZR L3-VDT through the infamous M3F and MSF forums until getting information from these sites became harder then drinking a blizzard through a straw. So I'm turning you, the most excellently informed community here at MNMazda to help fill me in on what the latest developments are and what where we stand with getting the most reliable power out of these. I haven't paid attention over the past year or so and I'd like to know what’s going on with tuning solutions.

Last I heard there were three, AP had its fan club, CP-E had its fan club and there was a new, open source (?), tuning solution that a few were trying but there was little real world data on it. The AP was mostly being recommended to those with mid-level, ~350whp goal, and the CP-E solution for those with big turbo plans. The last big hurtle that was being looked was how to get around the shorter pulse width the injectors have that is inherent to DISI fuel system.

What's changed with this situation? What new problems have been found, read a little of picklz post about the cams, but not sure on the whole back story.

 

[JohnnyT]

Well..AP can keep up with the big turbos now and is proven to make over 400whp.

Injector seals are out from CP-e.

Still no update on cams or new injectors - though they weren't sweating at 573whp so that's not going to be an issue for....anyone for awhile.

The biggest advancement is that people can make 400whp out of the DISI and do it relatively easily and for a couple grand. Stock bottom end has shown to take upwards of 450whp+ and the clutch holds up just fine at those levels too. Many more people are doing BT builds but there's not a 'monster' build yet (besides the 573whp car, but that was just a one-time deal).

 

[spek1098]

Thanks for the info JT,
How were the fuel limitations overcome? Can this be done with only minor modifications to the DISI (HPFP, injector seals)? Last I heard people were obsessed with meth injection as a temporary solution and there was talk of using a secondary EFI system.

 

[mndsm]

That's basically it Jurgen. The ECU (as I understand it) wasn't equipped to handle the pulsewidths that you need on a BT build. So after the CDFP was there, and the seals were there, it cook CP-E Actually getting the FCF to work so you could fuck with the injector tables more.

 

[JohnnyT]

Thanks for the info JT,
How were the fuel limitations overcome? Can this be done with only minor modifications to the DISI (HPFP, injector seals)? Last I heard people were obsessed with meth injection as a temporary solution and there was talk of using a secondary EFI system.

As far as I know a CDFP and access to the fuel/injector tables is all you'd need, and the AP's tables are accessible. Meth isn't being used solely for power by most people, it's split between that and utilizing its cleaning properties. I've seen more people use meth on stock turbo than BT builds too.

That's basically it Jurgen. The ECU (as I understand it) wasn't equipped to handle the pulsewidths that you need on a BT build. So after the CDFP was there, and the seals were there, it cook CP-E Actually getting the FCF to work so you could fuck with the injector tables more.

AP's got the injector tables working too. Hell I'd bet there's more people pushing 400whp+ with an AP these days than the SB.

 

[mndsm]

That's not the way it originally was, didn't it take the APv2 to figure that out?

 

[JohnnyT]

^ Took an update for ATR.

 

[JohnnyT]

Reading material on injectors and pulse width: http://www.mazdaspeedforums.org/forum/f303/have-you-measured-when-injectors-39696/

jwilkins88 - MS3 - Cobb AP - GT3076 @ 27psi - 494/481

Stock block, stock tranny, stock clutch

More info: http://www.mazdaspeedforums.org/for...hp-481-fwtq-wcf-djuosnteisn-cf-5500-ft-73401/

djuosnteisn - MS6 - CP-e SB - GT3071 @ ?? psi - 449/527

Stock block, stock tranny, stock clutch

More info: http://www.mazdaspeedforums.org/forum/f338/cars-no-longer-acting-fool-my-first-sb-dyno-59440/

driver311 - MS3 - Cobb AP - GT3071 @ 18psi - 395/385

Stock block, stock tranny, stock clutch

His dyno sheet is embedded so click here for more info: http://www.mazdaspeedforums.org/forum/f338/driver311-atp3071r-18-19psi-dyno-pull-70191/

11cruzito11 - MS3 - Cobb AP - GT3076 @ 22psi - 389/364

Built block, not sure if stock clutch/tranny but it was a very conservative tune

His dyno sheet is embedded so click here for more info: http://www.mazdaspeedforums.org/forum/f338/my-cobb-access-port-dyno-11cruzito11-75388/

BrianGT3076 - MS3 - Cobb AP - T3 GT3076 @ 20psi - 392/379

Stock block, stock tranny, stock clutch

His dyno sheet is embedded so click here for more info: http://www.mazdaspeedforums.org/forum/f338/my-t3-3076-dyno-65415/


cageyvet had some monster build making 573whp @ 35psi on a PTE5557 with the help of a 50 shot and meth but I can't find it. I documented it here: http://www.mnmazda.com/forum/showth...make-power-with-some-serious-help.&highlight=

There's a lot more people in the mid-high 300s and a few over that as well, but these are the ones I knew off hand...

 

[amoosenamedhank]

It's almost stupid easy to make 400hp with a few grand these days.

Step 1. Buy SteedSpeed Twin Scroll Exhaust Manifold
Step 2. Buy Dustin Jones (msf member) 3" V-Band DP matched for said EM
Step 3. Buy GT3076 .78 a/r with divided housing
Step 4. Bring to someone who can tune car with AP or SB

With this setup, you can have you cake and eat it too. The 3076 should get you to 400hp while the TS design should keep the spool times closer to a GT28.

Obviously there are other supporting mods to pull this off (injector seals, FMIC, CC)... but as far as big pieces, this should get you a reliable 400hp car.

 

[mndsm]

You guys are REALLY tempting me. 400whp sounds like fun.

 

[amoosenamedhank]

.... It is

 

[amoosenamedhank]

Update on Pricing....

I just figured out that the SpeedSteed Twin Scroll, Top mount Exhaust manifold is $750 (MS6 only... MS3 must use stock location manifold because of hood clearance issues)
The DJ DP kit (which includes 3" V-Band DP, oil/coolant lines for GT turbo, and intake) will be $650 (amazing deal!)

So really add the cost of the GT3076r ($1,350 new) and you're talking turkey brother!

 

[spek1098]

Thanks for all the great resources. Going to take me a few lunches to get through it all. I'm planning on an AP for this summer and was also considering a DP. Guess I'll hold off on the DP then till the snail starts smoking and do a BT setup at that point.

 

[mndsm]

Thanks for all the great resources. Going to take me a few lunches to get through it all. I'm planning on an AP for this summer and was also considering a DP. Guess I'll hold off on the DP then till the snail starts smoking and do a BT setup at that point.

Smart man. Given that a DP was a lot of the reason people were cooking seals due to overboosting anyhow, doesn't really make a whole lot of sense to upgrade til you need to.

 

[JohnnyT]

Run some 5w40 and she'll be fine...

 

[mndsm]

You can do that, or you can just not honk your turbobooster.

 

[JohnnyT]

^ That's what a TOOOOOOOOOOON is for....